What Does the Bible Say About Masturbation?

The Bible is notably silent on the issue of masturbation. Some people have argued that the sin of Onan in Genesis 38 was about masturbation, but that is not the core issue that displeased the Lord. Onan’s duty was to produce offspring on behalf of his brother who had predeceased him and he didn’t want to give his sperm for a child that wouldn’t be his. So he would have sex with Tamar and pull out and ejaculate outside of her. This displeased the Lord so much that Onan was struck dead. It was wicked in the Lord’s sight, not because of the act of pulling out, but rather because Onan dishonored his responsibility to Tamar. God is much more concerned with what is happening in our heart when we sin, than the actual act.

The understanding I have come to regarding the issue of masturbation is that it appears that in and of itself, it is not a sin. The problem is that often there is no separation between masturbation and other sin issues that the Lord has been clear about.

Let’s use this episode of Friends as an example. Chandler is caught masturbating by Monica, but the sin issue isn’t that he was masturbating, but rather that he chose to give into temptation and was lusting after someone in porn. If he had been talking to his wife on the phone and they were mutually celebrating their sexuality together, focused on growing in intimacy with one another, I would not have a problem with this situation (save that it isn’t something others should be watching occur on TV), but this is the problem: masturbation and lust are often viewed as the same act because the masturbation and the lust can be happening simultaneously. God has been clear about lust. In His Kingdom, lust and adultery are no different from one another so to get aroused from pornography and then masturbate with lust in one’s heart would be sin. This would displease the Lord not because touching yourself sexually is sin, but because 1) the person being lusted after is one of His kids and it disrespects them, 2) the person being lusted after belongs to their spouse (either now or in the future) and it disrespects their relationship with one another and 3) what a person focuses on when they orgasm becomes a tie in their soul to that thing which damages the sexual relationships they might have that God established and blessed as right.

The Lord is very concerned with anything that interferes with our relationship with Him. If someone is masturbating to the extent that it becomes a greater focus in their lives than the Lord, then it can become a sin issue, but a person could masturbate every day and still not have it be something that comes between them and the Lord in the same way that a couple could have sex every day and still be well balanced contributors in the Kingdom of God. If it becomes an addiction to them which then usurps the position of Jesus as Lord of their life, this is where the line is crossed to having masturbation become a sin. Again it is a heart issue, not the act.

Another consideration is that in marriage solo masturbation should not replace sexual union between a husband and wife. Under normal circumstances, the priority is for the couple to join together for sex. If the husband and wife mutually discuss and accept that there are circumstances when they bless the other to masturbate, then they just need to be sure that it is not replacing their union. “The two will become one flesh” is one of the most amazing promises and blessings from the Lord and that should be the priority.

So in summary, let us acknowledge that it is the condition of a person’s heart that determines if their masturbation a sin, not the act itself. Let us focus every part of our lives on the Lord and submit all issues pertaining to masturbation to Him. Let us always walk in self control and not let anything have mastery over us. I don’t want my kids growing up believing that their sexuality is bad or to be ignored while they are single. I want them to learn how to have self control and manage their sexuality in a godly way.

104 Comments

  1. I feel like there is one important aspect that needs to be considered here, as well.

    Speaking from personal experience, I can say that sexual activity creates a satisfaction of the drive that can last up to a week for some. I discovered that if my husband wanted to make love within a couple days following a large self-created orgasm, my desire for him was lower, and I had to work harder to appear to be into it.

    When I stopped masturbating and waited for him to satisfy my needs, our love life was so much more pleasurable for me (and he noticed the difference).

    I am not saying anything against masturbation, but just want to say that it is possible that masturbation could interfere with your level of desire for your mate.

    Consider the “recovery time” a man needs after ejactulation. I have found that I have a similar recovery time after orgasm. A long time ago, I made the case to my husband that when he masturbates, he makes himself unavailable for me for however long it takes for his desire to return. I was not surprised to realize that the same is true for me.

    So the personal choice that I have made is to be very aware of our timelines if I feel the need to gratify myself. If it has been a few days and I know my husband will be needing me again soon, I refrain. If he is going to be too busy or tired or is sick and I know that several days will pass before he needs me again, then I feel safe that I can take care of my needs without affecting his sex life.

    After all, I have promised that I am his. And if I want to keep him faithful, I need to be sure that I can give him 100% of me when he needs it. Knowing your sexual self also means knowing your sexual limits and being considerate of your mate before pushing youself to those limits without including him.

  2. I just learned about this website on the radio and thought I would check it out. I am always for being vocal about traditionally taboo topics within the Church, because I think one of the ways Satan traps Christians is to isolate them so that they can attack their confidence in Jesus Christ much easier. For this I am glad to see this site.
    However, I must respectfully disagree with your position on Masturbation for a number of reasons:
    Paul addresses the Corinthian Christians in a time where their culture was extremely sexually immoral, using sex in the worship of pagan gods- and that immorality was leading these new believers astray.
    1. I Corinthians 7:8-9 says, “Now to the unmarried and to the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I am. But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.” The context of this verse strongly suggests that the passion Paul is speaking of is sexual desire. If a person is masturbating regularly, then where is the passion that they are supposedly burning with?
    2. A few verses up in 7:4-5, “The wife’s body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband’s body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife. Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.” what temptation or lack of self-control do we face if we are satisfying our sexual desires through masturbation? And if my body belongs to my wife, then my masturbation is selfishly serving myself, not focusing on her needs. If my wife and I agree to refrain from sex, it should be for the purpose of devotion to God through prayer. This is called “delayed gratification,” not for gratification’s sake, but so that we are exercising self-discipline for greater devotion to God. We cannot practice this if we are masturbating.
    3. As a man, I can confidently say that masturbation is an addictive force that always leads a man to have lustful thoughts. It may be possible, with enough determination and focus to masturbate without entertaining lustful thoughts, but he will always, constantly be bombarded with temptation to do so. The Bible is filled with examples of the wisdom of fleeing from temptation and not toying with it. For example; Joseph and Potiphar’s wife (He did not just resist in his mind, he got up and ran out of the house), “flee (run away from) sexual immorality”- I Corinthians 6:18, “Flee the evil desires of youth,” 2Tim. 2:22. Lustful thoughts fall under the category of sexual immorality in these verses. Please, don’t take my word for it, seek out God through His Word and ask Him to lead you into truth and wisdom.
    Our world is much like the ancient Corinthians- we are constantly being bombarded with the so-called “wisdom” of psychology, the modern day god, that encourages us to embrace our humanity and leads us to worship and confidence in our own strength. But God says that we are sinful by nature and in desperate need of redemption through Jesus Christ and the only way we will find salvation, true confidence (in the power of God), security, and lasting peace is if we get our eyes off of ourselves and onto Him and those around us. Jesus said this is the greatest commandment, to “love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.” and the second is like it, “Love your neighbor as yourself.” There is nothing here about “self-love” because if you keep these commands, God will take care of you and you will be fully satisfied in Him.
    Sorry if I sounded a little “preachy” there at the end, I just sensed the Spirit moving πŸ™‚

  3. We always welcome people to share a difference of opinion with us as long as they are respectful so your comment is welcome. I will interact with some of the comments you made. I think most of your post is your opinion based on how God has lead you through scripture and so I will share my perspective on it.

    1. Masturbation does give a sexual release to the person doing it, but it does not take away desire for sexual relationship with a person. To burn with passion is often to desire someone, not just a sexual release. I see in these verses that Paul is saying that if you can not control your passion for someone, then you should marry them. He is not saying if you are horny, look for someone to marry to you can have sex.

    2. I agree that if a couple is abstaining for purposes of prayer that this would also be a time to abstain from masturbation as well. But saying that all masturbation is wrong because of this verse would be the same as saying that all intercourse is wrong too. Masturbation is not self serving at the expense of your spouse necessarily. It can be, but we have always said that if you are available and ready when your spouse wants sex, then masturbation can be incorporated into a healthy sex life in marriage.

    3. I know you are a man, but you can not say that the struggle you have to masturbate without lustful thoughts applies to every man. I have heard many men say that when they began masturbating they were completely connected to what their body was doing and lust was not an issue. I will teach my son and daughter the same as they become sexually aware.

    Finally, please do not assume that we have not prayed about masturbation to see if it is something God is pleased with in our walk with Him. If you have and He has lead you to abstain from it, then you should, but they way he has spoken to you through his living word about masturbation which is never mentioned directly in it, may not be the way he speaks to everyone. He knows your weaknesses and will lead you according to that.

  4. As a man, i understand seminarystudent756’s point of view, however I must disagree. I believe that Paul is speaking in broad strokes about attitudes sexuality and obviously never mentions masturbation directly. Masturbation absolutely can be addictive just as alcohol or television, or prescription drugs, and it is not really sexually satisfying to me. It simply provides a biological release. I can get addicted to having sex with my wife and it be a very unhealthy dependance and dynamic. I believe that when people masturbate excessively or look at porn and/or become addicted to both, it is often as a way to detach themselves from the feelings that they have about their sexuality. This, in my opinion, is a heart issue, not a sex issue, and is extensively addressed by Paul in the books of Romans, Ephesians, and by Jesus in the sermon on the mount [Matt 5]. When a person’s heart is not fixated on Christ and his commandments, then his/her sexuality will be sinful, no matter what the context, he/she will lust. This is not burning with the passion that God gave us for a sexual connection with a woman [as paul mentioned in letters to cor], but damaging your own emotions and ability to relate to God and people in a futile attempt to objectify something that was intended for love. I don’t mean any disrespect toward seminarystudent756, but not everybody touches their own body to escape their own emotions and lust for another. This issue is so much more complicated than that. What if a woman is having trouble getting aroused physically, but her heart and mind want to provide passion and intimacy for her husband, so she touches her self to help things along. True in a perfect set of circumstances, he would know exactly what to do, or she would know exactly how to coach him on what to do. However, in this case, she is touching herself so that she does not deprive her husband of the intimacy and passion that he needs. Some people touch themselves to try and accept the body that God has given them as it is, no more, no less. They do not necessarily do it with an end in mind [i.e climax]. They are simply embracing their sexuality. This can be very difficult and complicated for someone who has been through emotional or physical abuse, especially as a child. Some people might touch themselves in order to remain faithful to their spouse during a difficult time. What if a woman’s husband is deployed to Iraq for a year or 2? What if a spouse is injured? What if a spouse is depressed, or has cancer, or has recently had a baby and can not be intimate? Doctors recommend 6 weeks with no intercourse after the birth of a child. For my wife, intercourse was painful for almost 5 months after our 2nd child was born. 5 months dude.

    The fact that Paul felt compelled to instruct the church in Corinth to not deprive each other meant that they were probably doing just that. As you mentioned, we live in a world that is very similar to Corinth. This means that born-again Christain spouses are going to deprive each other from time to time. I wish that every man’s wife could manually stimulate him or give him oral sex any time he needs her touch after the birth of a child, but you can not possibly expect her to fulfill your every desire while taking care of 2 toddlers and nursing another baby. If she is simply exhausted, and it has been weeks since you have been with her, and you desire to be intimate with her. If you manually stimulate your own penis while she lies next to you in bed with her hand on your chest, or while her arms are around you, is this what Paul was talking about? This is masturbation, and it is not self-gratification, but it is sharing an intimate sexual relationship with your wife, and very clearly communicating to her that you are comfortable with your body the way that God made it, and you are happy with the effort that she does give toward your relationship. This is not done shamefully and in private. If one struggles with lust, he can touch and look at his wife while doing this. This can take so much pressure off of her during an already exhausting time. This is a heart issue, one of love for our wives, not a sexual issue.

    I also interpret her having authority over my body as me giving her the right to say no. Also, at times it can mean that I go without any sexual gratification for a while. If she is inconsiderate when she refuses you, then that means that she is human. We are called to love her unconditionally.

    It is also important to clearly define what exactly we are talking about in relation to masturbation. Are we speaking only about stimulating yourself to full orgasm, or simply touching yourself to get aroused? Again, if a wife is in bed with her husband and wants to get aroused for his benefit, and is having trouble and touches herself to get things going for him, then this is definately a way that she is doing the opposite of depriving him. What if she continues until she does climax? I believe that this issue can be compared to eating meat, or certain foods, or watching certainmovies, or drinking alcohol. For some people who struggle with lustful thoughts, they might need to abstain from masturbation all together. For a person who struggles with alcohol abuse, they probably should abstain from alcohol.

    We could go on with this thread indefinately, these are just some of my thoughts and feelings. You guys feel free to comment and disagree. This is a debate that could go on forever.

  5. Sorry for my delay in reply. Honestly, I have been thinking a lot about this issue as it is something that has recently come up in Christian teachings. As a seminary student, I am always interested in growing in knowledge of the current beliefs and practices of the Christian culture (and the world in general), so that I can answer those who have questions and remain faithful to the Scriptures. I have been raised very strictly that masturbation is always a sin- and it was a convincing position since most men masturbate as a response to their lustful thoughts. I have thought about masturbation without lusting before, but the Godly men in my life who I’ve been open with have been very skeptical that it is even possible. If there were any men who did not share that struggle, I assumed those men were about 2% of the population, and only because they have successfully persevered in resisting masturbation or were so sheltered that masturbation never crossed their mind in the first place.
    I have been seriously considering the idea of separating lust from masturbation because some people that I have always respected are beginning to take up this position in helping men overcome lust, so I suppose it is worth checking out – and I have been running into a lot of websites lately that approach lust this way.
    The verse I presented earlier was a passage that many refer to in defense of masturbation being a sin, I suppose it is debatable whether that refers to the passion of sexual tension. Even if this passage is dealing with sexual tension, I wouldn’t think for a minute that it is suggesting that the only reason a person should get married is because they are horny, although it seems that would be ONE reason.
    I have much sympathy for the married couple who run into difficulty surrounding the time of child birth or a couple who are away from each other for an extended period of time. I don’t have children, so I cannot quite identify with that, but I could surely imagine the difficulties. Several months is a long time to go without sex, but it’s not impossible. Many people who have been promiscuous before getting married have had success in abstaining from sex for a long period of time until they become married. And there are some who have been successful at abstaining from masturbation for several months. While I am seriously considering your position and seeing the logic in it, it is also not impossible to abstain.
    My pastor preached today from Romans 14 about Christian liberties and this issue was the first thing that popped into my head. I want to be careful that I am only applying this passage to non-essential matters of the faith and not using Romans 14 as an excuse for Christian laziness.
    Finally, I apologize, cinnamonsticks, that I offended you where I said, “Please, don’t take my word for it, seek out God through His Word and ask Him to lead you into truth and wisdom.” I wasn’t trying to imply you haven’t searched the Scriptures and wrestled with this before God. I was just trying to encourage anyone who read it (not specifically directed at you) to challenge what I say and take it before God. The last thing I want is for someone to blindly follow things taught by Man, whether it comes from my mouth or someone else. Not that I automatically assume everyone reading this is dumb and blind (col128 is one proof that there are intelligent readers out there), but we can all be “blind” at times and need little reminders. Everything must be held against the light of the Word. Anytime I read someone’s position on any given topic, one of the first things I look for is strong Scriptural support. This is one thing I’ve been learning at seminary, all of our reasoning must be supported with Scriptural proof.

    Peace be with you.

  6. Also, related to this topic, what does Christian Nymphos think about nude art that is non-erotic as a tool to train a person to see the nude body for its beauty rather than as an object of lust. Also relating to naturism. I ask this because a Godly man I have long respected has become involved with naturism and while I tend to be skeptical, I want to understand more of this approach. Do you think it is a reasonable method to encourage a person to use in fighting a pornography addiction?

  7. Apology accepted.

    Regarding your question about nude art, I am going to ask an artist friend of mine if she would come over here and lend her expertise in this area.

  8. Hi! I’m ‘the artist’ πŸ˜‰ I specialize in the nude female form, primarily to help women be set free from hated of their bodies. Secondarily, I find it’s a wonderful gift for husbands so they can have a beautiful image of a nude that is their wife! They can enjoy away!

    As far as a pornography addiction, I’m not sure about using art as a way to heal that; I see art as a way to *discourage* porn addictions from beginning b/c it takes away the ‘oooh, let’s be rebellious and look at nude women’ aspect that I believe sheltering boys from *any* natural exposure to ordinary nudity can cause. By ‘ordinary’, I mean a woman breastfeeding, classic art, locker rooms, etc. I believe we’ve gone too far in the wrong direction to ‘protect’ against lust issues if that makes sense. Nudes used to regularly appear in cathedral art, now we have stark white walls and ‘safe’ art like Rembrandt’s ‘The Prodigal Son’ (a profound piece to be sure, but I’m using this to make a point). Our boys grow up in a vacuum where the female form is treated as fire and covered up; they have no idea how to look at a woman and not lust because they are TOLD they WILL struggle with this and aren’t given any tools to deal with this other than ‘bounce your eyes’ (something that makes beautiful women feel like the plague, BTW).

    Men who study art gain an appreciation for the human form; they learn that looking at a woman’s body doesn’t incite lust if they don’t entertain those thoughts; I’ve seen enough men in a 3 hour drawing session with a female model simply sit there and do their job; no drooling involved! Add Christian man to that, and you get a man who can understand context, who can understand that he has control over whether or not he lusts when he sees a woman–it’s not an uncontrollable urge!

    So I guess I see good nude art, art that portrays the beauty of the female (and male) form to be healthy, and a good way to help our young men figure out how to handle themselves around women; the female form is not bad, not sinful, not the problem. It’s the *thoughts* that men entertain that are the issue. If boys growing up see ‘ordinary’ nudity like breastfeeding, classic art, etc. I can’t help but think they will be less likely to freak out at seeing a breast or cleavage (or the blatant porn in European countries should they live there or go on a mission trip).

    As for porn, I don’t see how using nude art as a tool will help–that’d be like giving a hard-core vodka drinker a mimosa to ‘get over’ an alcohol addiction, KWIM? I believe strongly that men can be *completely* set free from a porn addiction so that they *can* eventually see the female form in art as beautiful, but they first must address issues in their hearts that caused the addiction to begin with or else they are trading one for the other.

    As for naturism, well, I’ve spent enough time on beaches with Europeans to see how their men simply don’t react at all to seeing breasts all over the place. I’m still suspicious of American men pursuing naturism; I know not all American men struggle with lusting after nude women, but I would be skeptical of a man who had struggled with porn turning to a naturist lifestyle to get over porn. I do think there are appropriate boundaries for nudity, and naturism crosses those boundaries IMO. There is a HUGE difference between nudity in art and walking around doing everything nude in a group of people, KWIM?

    I hope I’ve answered the question! I’ll check back to see if there are more questions brought up by my post!

  9. Thanks for chiming in! πŸ˜€

  10. I am not up on the internet lingo: “KWIM?” “IMO?” Is “KWIM?” somethin’ like “ya’ dig?”

    Thanks for sharing your experience. You are the first person who seems to have a “middle ground” position. I have not discussed the topic of nude art with many people yet because I am a student at a pretty conservative (though excellent) seminary and while my church’s (again, an excellent, solid church) biggest outreach is into the art community, they are also conservative Baptists as well. I just haven’t found much diversity on this issue among them, though my church would probably be the most likely place I’d find it since a majority of them come from diverse backgrounds and many of them are artists.

    I am familiar with Arterburn’s bouncing the eyes technique. As I study Biblical Counseling more (my major) I am seeing that this approach seems helpful and seems like it would work, but the problem is it is dealing merely with a behavior and not addressing the lust issues of the heart or the root issue, the desire to be worshipped- to be God. This is a much more serious sin than looking at a few pictures, although pornography does have its consequences too… so anyway, I am just agreeing with you here, it sounds like this is what you’re saying.
    If bouncing the eyes makes women feel like the plague, I would assume that staring creeps them out too. So the focus should not be whether we are looking or not looking, but are we treating the opposite sex like a valuable human being with real emotions and so much more depth than outward appearances reveal.
    I’ve been to Europe and I understand what you’re talking about. “‘I’ve heard Europeans say, “You can always tell who the Americans are. They’re the ones with their tongues hanging out of their mouths.” The open display of porn on the magazine racks was the thing that surprised me most, though I was not ignorant of it before I went, it did anger me quite a bit.
    One of the things that causes many Christian men to run from any hint of nudity so much is because we are primarily visual creatures, any view of the female body has the potential to tempt us and trip us up. While we may not be sinning in our attraction to it, the winds can change quickly and without warning. The Bible says we are to “flee temptation.”… in essence, don’t “dance with the Devil.” Also, I realized God made clothes for Adam and Eve because of their sin (a verse many naturists like to focus on) , so this should be reason to stay covered because it is a symbol of the shame of our sinfulness before God- While there is no shame in the way God created them, their eyes have been opened to sin and it was necessary for them to be covered so that they did not stumble. If we accidentally see a naked person, don’t freak out, but also be on guard lest the enemy cut our throats when we’re looking the other way. (Sorry for the graphic imagery, I am a guy after all! πŸ™‚
    The man I know who recently became a naturist does have a history of pornography addiction. I am not sure where he is currently with that, I know he has taken great strides, but naturally I was concerned when he told me about his new interest.

    Anyway, that’s what I’m thinking right now- feel free to agree or disagree with me…

  11. KWIM = Know What I Mean
    IMO = In My Opinion

  12. Hello to all of you,

    These communications between fellow brothers and sisters in Christ encourage me more than ever to return to this site again and again.

    Why?

    Because I am so greatly released from literally years of sexual bondage, almost frigidity, due to the unforgiveable misdirection of seemingly well meaning older women in Christ.

    The ladies I was involved with, carefully and artfully placed their own horribly unsatisfying sexual experiences upon the backs of the younger ones in their midst, including moi.

    To a woman, they were of Southern Baptist persuasion or charismatic believers who were from Baptist roots. Nothing against this denomination but sex is a sore point inside it.

    The amount of woman to woman listening I have done through the years as marriages have hit rock bottom and wives and husbands zeroed out their relationships in the church has been crushing. It has been an eye-opening experience as to the state of the church in this land….and I have no counseling degree, just an open and friendly dispostion!

    (I do take ownership for the times when I did see a bit of light and rejected it through guilt from being promiscuous in my late teens.)

    However, the overall impression most of the older, Christian women gave towards sexuality was of disdain and I bordered upon demonic possession if I were to venture into the realm of sexual satisfaction EVEN WITH my own husband.

    SeminaryStudent756, I salute your willingness to even LOOK at this topic in your life.

    You are in a spiritually daunting situation which has choked the sexual life out of many before you so I will pray for you as you pursue your career in counseling.

    How can a confidant be any use if he/she cannot empathise with those coming their way? The truth is …. it is not a possibility. I know this to be true because of the “fall out” ladies I have to spend hours on the phone with after receiving so-called Christian counseling for marriage.

    I am bitter, yes, I admit it . Yet, I am also healing marvelously as I pursue the desire I have allowed myself to feel towards my darling man.

    If I had known then what I know now about how much bliss can be shared with one’s spouse in the marriage bed, I would have rocked the worlds of so many searching women.

    You can only imagine how zealous I am towards being used by the Lord to reach out to the hurting women in the Body of Christ. What an honor and an awesome responsibility.

    Please forgive my ineptness at editing my posts as I am unused to conveying my thoughts vie this medium and am more of a talker than a writer. I also apologize for ruffling any feathers. Unintentional.

    Totally and awesomely in Christ,

    smokeypuss.

    .

  13. Seminarystudent, you are on the right track πŸ˜‰ What my personal desire is is to see men set free and walking in maturity. I will use my husband as an example. He doesn’t struggle with lust, and he is every bit as visual as any man (but for the record, I am just as visual). He can see a beautiful woman in skimpy clothes, think ‘huh, she’s beautiful, and that outfit would ROCK on my wife’. His mind never goes beyond seeing her. He’s taught himself appropriate boundaries so he doesn’t cross any lines. The result is that he can look any woman in any clothing in the eye and speak to her. And women in the church notice! One of my good friends is a model. She is possibly the most beautiful woman I know, both inside and out. And she is shocked that my husband *looks* at her; he doesn’t look over her shoulder, doesn’t bounce his eyes, he simply looks her in the eye when he talks to her! That’s what I mean by bouncing the eyes making beautiful women feel like the plague–men WON’T LOOK AT US at any time!! It’s not right! She has had more men look away or turn away from her simply because she’s beautiful. I understand they don’t want to lust, but that’s just rude! And not the answer for the long term.

    So I say that eye bouncing is a tool, a stepping stone on the path to freedom. Use it for a time, but it’s by NO MEANS the end of the journey. Something that would make anyone in the Body of Christ feel like a second class citizen is not a good idea for a permanent fix.

    And Smokeypuss–ROCK ON, girl!!! You sound like me in many ways!!

  14. Hello therealforca,

    Thanks for the encouragement. We can all use lots of it in this unique quest of ours.

    I can promise you all, if anyone I deal with on a daily basis knew I was developing in this way, they would alternately lose their hair, have their eyeballs fall out and in general, look really ugly.

    Know what, I don’t give a flip anymore. I am so glad to be doing what I should have been doing towards my darling man all my 23 married years. He has such a lusty personality and is one mass of body builder muscle which I now find so amazingly sexy but for so long, I refused to go there in my mind. Now, he has a bundle of sexual woman panting after him and he is having a ball with me. Naughty middle aged woman giggle!!

    I am tight with my God but I am finally FREE to get all over my husband and he is the happiest married stud you can think of.

    We are so absolutely into each other that it is almost overwhelming because our passion is so mutual and so satisfying.

    I have been able to do all the wonderfully erotic things that these ladies who monitor this site have suggested. We rock sexually….FINALLY.

    If anyone had even broached any of the subjects mentioned here ,with total freedom, at the beginning of this past summer, I would have probably exploded with self righteous indignation. How blind I was and how my darling man suffered.

    I adjure all the women on this site to keep up doing what you are doing.

    There is so much wonderful stuff happening in all of our lives and I am truly excited to see what God is doing with all of this. Amazingly an answer to many years of agonizing prayer for the Body of Christ in this nation. An intercessor’s dream come true. Huge joyous shouts in my kitchen as I type this. O.k. done for the night. Smiles of fellowship to you all. smokeypuss.

  15. Oh one more thing, SeminaryStudent756, was this a rockingly wonderful message to read from a middle aged married woman or what…..Let God work in your mind and heart and you will see amazing things happening in and around you. You have my genuine prayer support until I hear you are free like all of us here. smokeypuss.

  16. Thanks for sharing, smokeypuss. I am glad you are finding freedom in Christ. Also, I never grew up in the Southern Baptist churches, I’m one of those “northern baptists,” so I can’t say I am familiar with all the cultural stuff going on that has affected so much of their teaching- although I am becoming more and more familiar every day. But take heart, I am at the leading school of the SBC and while they used to be extremely liberal, the past few years, under the leadership of the new president has brought some big strides in bringing everything back to the centrality of Scripture. While we have solid theology, we have a ways to go on some of these issues of Christian liberty and hopefully we will always remain teachable and seeking greater conformity to Christ, and it is my hope that everything that comes out of our school will eventually trickle down into Southern Baptist Churches everywhere.

    I would say that I am probably one of the few at the seminary that would dare talk about these subjects in such a straightforward way, but I should probably keep my mouth shut because I’ve been surprised by the people here(at the seminary) before. I think people here are more open to it than we would think. I have found that as I got past the stereotypes I had of Southern Baptists and seminary faculty/students, that they aren’t as uptight as I thought they were. Actually, what I’ve found in some of them on the liberty issues was either hiding from it behind theology or a dangerous laxity- which is scary, because if we are going to exercise our Christian freedom, then we need to have some strong convictions in place to keep us from sinning. I think the reason for the laxity is because these subjects along with drinking, dancing, etc… have been so taboo, but the younger people are seeing non-Southern Baptist Christians do this and say its okay, but the Baptist kids have no foundation for it to guide them, so they end up indulging the flesh. Not to say the northern baptists are perfect either though. I think people want to talk about it, but there’s always the fear of social repercussions that have plagued the Southern Baptist Churches for so long.
    In case there’s anyone out there just tuning in, I have a great love and respect for Southern Baptists and am in no way trying to speak bad of them. My goal is to see all Christians of any denomination united in Jesus and be able to give/receive constructive criticism from within their denominations as well as from others in a way that testifies to the love and diversity of God’s people. But in all our criticism, we must always bring everything back to Scripture so that we do not fall away from that.

    From the Christian liberties chapter, Romans 14:13,14,23- “Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in your brother’s way. As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for him it is unclean…..But the man who has doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating does not come from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.” Peace.

  17. Hello again seminarystudent756,

    Although I read your post this morning, I actually was stumped as to what to say to you. So, I did what I usually do when in a quandry. Took time to mull over what you are trying to say.

    Don’t ask me why but your plight has touched my heart as a prayer warrior ( no bragging ) and I feel there is more for you than you give God credit for!!

    I feel concerned in my heart that although you are listening to us and replying and getting your point across, you are taking a leaf out of Odysseus’ book by blocking your ears with wax and binding yourself to the mast of your ship so as to not cave in to the call of the sirens πŸ˜‰ Don’t shoot the messenger now.

    We can talk and banter back and forth about all the philosophies we all have been privvy to through the years as Christians….Christ followers… or we can take time to find some mountain top somewhere and really tune into His voice as to what He desires for our lives.

    It’s lonely on top of the mountain and there will be times when we will hear voices calling us to come down into the valley again but it would do us all well to wrest ourselves away from all that has been planted in our minds regarding interpretations of who Jesus Christ is and simply find out for ourselves.

    The amount of completion I have experienced by truly allowing myself to be a woman before the Lord Jesus Christ and embrace who he has made me to be in all areas including my sexuality, is a splendid miracle.

    Although we can discuss these issues with wonderful freedom on this site, beware of those who would place your skin upon the nearest wall for daring to think of, never mind converse about ,such topics. Guard your heart with all diligence so that out of it can flow the issues of life.

    You will be in my prayers as you are shown more and more light by the ever close presence of our Saviour. You are precious in His sight and ultimately, that is all that matters, is it not?

    smokeypuss.

  18. Wherever one stands on masturbation, one thing I (a frequent M-er) discovered when I was in a Christian marriage full of intimate spice was that masturbation was no longer needed.

  19. Okay… this is going to be a long one. Mainly because I want to respond to the last two posts.
    First, my current position on M’n. I’ve been reading a fair amount of material lately on m’n, actually it has been distracting me from my school work. I am excited for the semester to be over in a couple of weeks so I can devote more time to this study. This will probably be a popular topic in future ministry as I desire to work with youth. Many of the verses I’ve come across talk about not making provisions for the desires of the flesh. Most of the counsel I received as a young man was using these verses as instruction against m’n. But most of these are referring to the lusts of the flesh and the worship of pleasure (Hedonism). Which, I think you all would agree is wrong. The idea I’m getting from my reading is that habitual m’n is a sin because it influences the focus of the heart, leading the person to a Hedonistic lifestyle. This may be what these men may have been trying to tell me- or not. The point is that I took it to mean that all m’n is always a sin. If we are going to be Hedonists about anything, let it be Christ. John Piper (highly respected here at the seminary) recently began promoting the idea of Christian Hedonism- that is not worshiping pleasures of the flesh, but enjoying creation with the focus of bringing us to greater worship of God. Using the verses on lusts of the flesh as evidence for the sinfulness of non-habitual masturbation, I believe is a misinterpretation of scripture. I have seen this kind of misinterpretation in other areas, such as the belief that rock music is a sin because the Bible tells us to abstain from evil. This is prematurely assuming that rock is evil. People who believe this have no scriptural evidence for the evilness of rock music itself. I say this so definitely because this is an issue that I have studied and experienced in great depth. I used to believe it.

    Sorry to get off topic a little, but there’s where I’m at so far with the issue of m’n. If a person has gotten to this point, the hardest question now is what is habitual, or harder yet, am I being habitual? Not that these are real difficult questions to answer, but for many the love of their sin may be keeping them from admitting the truth. That said, there is a point where, for men, and I’m suggesting this for single men, that resisting any kind of ejaculation for a long enough period of time, your body will begin to produce regular “wet dreams” again which will provide the biological release that many find so difficult to resist. The problem is most single guys can’t get past that wall. I found a good resource (www.lustfreeliving.org) that encourage single men to work their way up to this point by 1. learning to separate lust from m’n 2. To gradually begin to wean yourself off of dependency until your WD’s kick back in and you don’t crave it so much anymore.

    Smokey, I am not sure I understand how you interpreted my last post. I am really seeing Jesus more clearly in the last few years than ever. Sure, Odysseus tied himself to his ship- because he knew his own weakness and the power of sin (not that he was a Christian). He made a wise choice by tying himself up like that and asking the man (I forget his name) to hold him accountable. He never would have made it home if he hadn’t.
    Mountain tops are great experiences and give us hope and encouragement for pressing on, but we should not be afraid to come down into the valley. Jesus came down from his “mountain” and walked in the “valley of the shadow of death” with us as an example for us to follow. He kept his eyes on the “mountain,” but lived and walked in the valley to the point of intense suffering, sorrow, and death on the cross, being forsaken by his Father. Living in the valley doesn’t mean we have to give in to sin, because Christ conquered death, death no longer has mastery over him. We will still face suffering and death in this life, but in Christ we are secure, we have overcome, nothing can snatch us out of his hand. This power of Christ is what gives Christians the ability to face all of life’s challenges and rise up in victory. This is what Romans 6,7,8 are all about. It is the very power of the Spirit that enables us to face such suffering and sin and walk in peace and victory.
    Also, on the subject of growing in knowledge of God (this is the definition of “theology”), the Bible says that our earnest searching for knowledge of Him is where you will find the fear of God and His wisdom (Prv. 2). If we want more outflow of our hearts for God, then we need to grow in knowledge, because the wisdom of God comes to our minds through studying His Word and should work its way into our hearts and out of our lives. I admit, the problem of many who are passionate about knowledge of God often fail to let that knowledge affect their lives. But the answer is not in running from the intellectual side of our faith, but in embracing both the Word and the Spirit in our lives. Let the Spirit use that “head knowledge” to heal our hearts and empower us to serve Him and others, bringing greater glory to God.

    If I have misunderstood what you were saying, please be patient with me and help me understand. I am not certain of what church you attend, but I have spent much time around my Pentacostal brothers and sisters and love them dearly, but these things are a result of wrestling with those teachings and my personal experiences within the Pentacostal church.
    For the record, my Baptist brothers and sisters here, I don’t think, would “hang my skin” for talking about these issues. That is not what I meant to communicate about that. I meant that I don’t think many really see any need to address these things in the Church or maybe be hesitant to do so, for fear of communicating a wrong idea. This is only an observation and I wouldn’t encourage anyone to consider this a fact about “all Baptists.”

    Peace.

  20. It is so refreshing to come across another place on the web that takes a mature and postive approach to the subject of masturbation. Over the years so many Christians have lived in such unnecessary bondage, and sometimes total misery, because of an unnecessary and unbiblical restriction.

    I wish my wife wanted as much sexual frequency as I do, but she does not. So, I have both her blessing and encouragement to “take care of my own needs.” Is this the ideal? No. But we are not living in an ideal world, so sometimes we do what we feel we need to do.

  21. Hello SeminaryStudent756,

    Note the upper case letters for your title….still a note of respect in my communications. I do respect you and will once again take some time to mull over your post as I hate speaking off the cuff. Back in a while.

    smokeypuss.

  22. O.k. SeminaryStudent756,

    What a great day I had mulling over your amazingly well presented posts.

    I have concluded that you are gifted in the intellectual realm of how to present your arguments and guess what, I am not.

    I am more of the ‘make a cup of tea/coffee and offer a tired person a relaxing and non-threatening environment or back massage’, type of person.

    There is room in the Body of Christ for both of us and I am going to leave the heavy duty how to’s and should not’s to amazingly gifted people like yourself.

    The funny part of this stepping aside from our discussion is that I have a husband who is an intellectual brain box who is the polar opposite from me. As soon as I read today’s post, it occurred to me that I was now getting way out of my league and thus will stop fencing words with you.

    I will sincerely pray for you as you have a great heart for truth and a potentially great outreach to those in the church.

    Please keep reading this site as the posters here are doing such a great job of communicating the very deepest revelations as to how we feel…(I use the word feel on purpose)….God would have us be towards our love lives.

    You are welcome here and I hope you feel my acceptance of you, as a person, overall.

    I am almost positive that the moderators of this site will echo my hand of friendship extended to you and will always have the welcome mat out. Neat group of women.

    Truly in Christ,

    smokeypuss.

  23. Hi Smokey, I don’t know if you are following this thread yet or not, but I wanted to share one last thing. I promise I’ll be “short.” πŸ™‚ I am actually more of a coffee/ beer (whatever your drink) kind of guy, but I am just being stretched in my mind right now as I am learning about these very things I’ve been saying. I just read the Odyssey this semester (for the first time) so that’s why I recall it so much. I hope no one feels intimidated or “out of my league” by my talk. I try hard to keep from “seminary speak” when I am off campus and speak normally, but the problem is, much of my time now is spent on campus. It is of no benefit to anyone if what I say is not understood. Also, I hope I am not assuming things too quickly. It is best to take conversations slow and ask a lot of questions so that people understand each other. Again, that’s mostly a result of being around the seminary. One of the amazing things about God that I’ve been learning during my studies, is that if we seek for knowledge of Him, He promises we will find it. It doesn’t matter who you are or where you’ve come from or your personality type, I’m a testimony to that! πŸ™‚ He places the cookies where we can reach them, but we do have to reach for them. Then as we are fed and grow stronger we can reach the better cookies on the higher shelf! (I don’t mean that arrogantly, but as an encouragement).

  24. I wanted to comment on givingmore’s question. A lot of good advice has been offered so far, but I want to address another possibility. (Hopefully you’re still on this thread)

    My concern is you and your wife’s reading of erotica. Erotica is pornography for the mind. This is a sin that needs to be addressed, but- and especially in a close relationship such as a marriage- it must be approached with the utmost gentleness and love. I see you mentioned earlier that you were trying to stop, that’s great! Hopefully your wife is too! I just want to encourage you both to seek to find your satisfaction in the Lord together and to always be re-directing your worship to Him. When our hearts are set on the right affections, our behaviors will fall into place. Definitely maintain those lines of communication in your relationship, not with the motive for yourselves to be known, but for you to know each other more deeply.

    I am a man who has struggled with pornography as a teen and into my early twenties, myself, and all of the masturbation that I did was a result of the lust in my heart, which is why I am so guarded against m’n now. Also, my father had struggled with porn as a younger man and my mother had been involved in an adulterous relationship as a result of falling into it. So, you understand why I am quick to speak against it… because it has caused a lot of grief in my family.

    I had been struggling with how much to write here… but I think I’ll stop here, though I do have a lot to say on this subject. But, maybe that’s not really a concern for you since you seem to be working on changing in that area.

    In His strength.

  25. Wow! This is my first time on this site and I just have to say I am so blessed that Christian women are speaking out about these things and spreading the word about what a blessing sex should be in marriage! There are so many hurting women, so many families torn apart by pornography (my parent’s marriage was one of them), so many who were raised racked with guilt over even being curious about sex or their bodies and I too struggled a lot with this growing up. We are pregnant with our first child and already I am thinking about how to teach my children about these subjects in a godly and wise manner – I can already see your site will be a place of great help in this regard! Thank you for addressing this topic and so many others. I look forward to learning more!
    Blessings!
    songofpraise

  26. Hello SongofPraise,

    Although I am just another person who reads this site, I wanted to say hello to you and welcome you to what will be a wonderful blessing in your life, as a young mother and wife.

    The opportunity to read and learn from mature Christian women who are not afraid to be on fire for their husbands and mature Christian men who are likewise towards their wives, is an awesome gift to you as you continue to unwrap these presents.

    Congratulations on your first ‘wombing-in’ blessing.

    Want to know the best way to address the topic of sexuality with your future children….embrace your womanhood fully and be on your man like white on rice through thick and thin πŸ˜‰ Keep reading here, Lady….

    (Happy Thanksgiving to all of you reading this post. I’m off to bake pies and other delightful goodies for my magnificent 7 and my better half)

    smokeypuss.

  27. I’m surprised after reading all of the discussion that one of the biggest arguments against masturbation was left out. This comes from Jesus himself in the Sermon on the Mount where He talks about adultery and lust. We might assume that Jesus used discretion while addressing the issue of masturbation directly in public. In His first public address in the middle of His discussion on lust and adultery He says:

    “If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to loose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell.” (Matt 5:29-30)

    If we assume that Jesus meant His teachings to be taken in context the question that should be obvious: “An eye causes a man to lust but how can his hand cause him to lust?” (Specifically how can his RIGHT HAND aid in lust?) Of course, the question is rhetorical for everyone understand that a hand only enters into the realm of lust through masturbation. If Jesus was refering to masturbation then we must agree with His view that the hand is a CAUSE of lust rather than a mere reaction to it.

    If another explanation can be applied to His words in context of lust then perhaps masturbation is not sin. I’ve not been able to find such a contextual answer. I’ve seen others argue that Jesus wasn’t talking about lust but since he just mentioned lust in the verses before and follows up with a discussion on adultery it is far fetched to think that his interjection was off topic.

    As to the I Corinthians 7:8-9 verse earlier it mentions only one means of rightfully satisfying a man “burning with passion”. It has already been testified above that masturbation lessens the burning of passion of both men and women. Unlike the Victorian era, Roman culture was promiscuous and very open to talking about sex. We have to assume that had Paul seen masturbation as an option he would have likely mentioned it. He talks freely about all other matters so it is hardly right to think Paul prudish.

    The verse in I Corinthians 7:4-5 uses a bit of strange language in saying that a husbands body is not his own but belongs to his wife. Everyone agrees this is talking about sexual relations and the way we should view them. A man must prefer his wife’s gratification and visa versa. I’d not seen this in context of masturbation before but it does present an argument. However, the argument is not against all masturbation but rather hidden masturbation. If he masturbates to please her or visa versa then there is no separation. However, if either masturbates privately excluding the other it breaks the rule of sharing put forth in the verse.

    From these three verses it seems to indicate that premarital masturbation could cause lust and the usual line of fleeing sexual immorality is in order. However, if the masturbation is within the context of marriage it must be with consent and full knowledge from the other. In this case the masturbation would not be profane but sacred. This would also follow since kinky sex may involve mutual masturbation. The marriage bed is to be kept sacred but no Scripture encourages the bed to be boring.

    P.S. One other line of reasoning that could be taken against sex toys specifically is in relation to graven images since we are not to PROSTITUTE ourselves to them. I’ve not had time to do the study yet but this discussion has aroused my interest. Perhaps some time in the future.

  28. I find it strange that most people here find it ok to mastturbate. I myself have never masturbated, mainly because it never really came to me(mind the pun!). My husband has had issues with pornography in the past, but is now doing well, and I just believe that as a married christian woman, it is my DUTY to please him whenever he needs realease. There is nothing that I find more sinful that him ‘taking care of himself’ if I know I could have helped him. I admit, it is a hard promise to keep, but I would rather know that I am not dissapointing God or my husband by saying no. It also allows us to depend on each other as husband and wife, to be as intimate as you can be, and to give unselfishly. We should be an example to the secular world out there, that we do not make our beliefs a grey zone, but that we firmly stand on our side of the fence.
    God bless you all.

  29. Because of my husband’s past issues, I have always been totally against masturbation. (Since then I mean, I wasn’t before that happened) And up until a little while ago I would have said so. I would have come on here and said “That is so wrong! How can you even think it’s ok?” But I am coming to the understanding that I can’t take my conclusions that I have drawn from MY experiences and try to say they should apply to everyone, if those are not conclusions that are drawn directly from the bible, without my own bias. Stokie, I never thought of that verse about “If your right hand causes you to sin” being about masturbation before, and I think that’s very interesting. The way I feel in MY marriage is that masturbation just doesn’t appeal to me much anymore. I have my husband, and it is infinitely more satisfying to be with him, so I wait until we can be together. We are very comfortable with mutual masturabtion. And I think mutual masturbation with a web cam or phone sex is a great option for business trips, and military couples and stuff. (And I have no problem with what another married couple totally in love with eachother chooses to do! I’m just saying what I am comfortable with for me.) Little story….The other night my husband was having a really bad night, and we started to have a little “comfort” lovin’. Just when I was getting into it, he finished, and in my head I was like “WHAT?!?” Because he always takes care of me first. On the one hand I liked the thought of being a nice, sacrificial wife, and giving him the gift of release without asking for anything for myself, but on the other hand, it was gonna take a lot to cool me down at that point….so I just smiled and said “Love you” and let him go to sleep, and then I was laying there thinking “Should I just take care of myself?” I seriously wrestled with it forever, and finally just went to sleep, somewhat resentful. Well, in the morning, he came over and snuggled with me, and he was like “I want to take care of you.” The sacrifice I had made the night before was not lost on him, and he made up for it, and I felt so loved! Now, I’m not trying to say that it would have been wrong for me to take matters into my own hands, as long as dh was ok with it, or that it was so noble that I didn’t or anything like that. But for me I know that if I would have, and then he approached me like that in the morning, I would have felt so bad! So, it was worth the wait. πŸ˜‰ Anyway, I’m not taking either side on the issue, because we all have the same Holy Spirit. Just putting in my two cents. I appreciate that everyone can share their opinions and be respectful even when we don’t always agree. πŸ™‚

  30. I haven’t had time to read all the posts but I see most of them are about masturbation in the context of marriage. I just wanted to add my two cents. πŸ™‚

    First of all, I am Catholic and extremely proud of it. The thing to understand is that both the Catholic and Orthodox Churches take pride in their adherence to tradition. They may have added some rules in over time but I don’t believe that those additions alone are reason enought to disparage the Catholic Church. (I say this because I saw a post on the site where someone complained about their “oppressive” Catholic upbringing.) And considering that some of these rules regarding sexuality are decided by priests who have devoted themselves to serving Jesus Christ and denied themselves rewards of the flesh their view of sexual acts may be different from that of a married couple.

    Second, I’m glad to have found this article. Onanism tends to be used as the main argument against masturbation although it really has nothing to do with masturbation at all, just a simple case of coitus interuptus. With all that’s going on today regarding the sanctity of marriage, I believe that masturbation for singles is the best way to uphold the values of matrimony. Although some might argue that masturbation spoils the surprise of the wedding night, nothing can replace the feelings of intimacy between you and your spouse. Sometimes people my age get married too young in order to circumvent the “no sex before marriage” rule. By relieving sexual tensions by yourself, you can make sure that when picking a spouse you are looking at their spiritual and emotional character rather than marrying for the sake of a “quick fix” and divorcing a few years later..

  31. We will not allow a lengthy debate on Catholicism vs. Protestantism, but suffice it to say that the writers of this blog are not Catholic and do not agree that it is harmless for people to add rules to what God has already established. This is what the Pharisees were so well known for and it made it harder for people to get to Jesus.

    I am fine with people having traditions, but am opposed when it becomes a requirement.

  32. I agree with Cinn. Sticks that if we are in the proper state of mind–meaning not lusting after others–then yes, masterbation is fine. But personally, I feel that for me, I miss something when I pleasure myself. I miss that connection with my husband. After I do it, even though I think of him while doing so, I feel I can’t tell him what I do while he’s at work…I’m ashamed because I feel he will think that he is not enough to satisfy me. He already has a size complex so I don’t want to give him more cause to believe that he really isn’t enough. I believe that these feelings are keeping me from truly enjoying him, and I don’t like that. I also feel that in pleasing ourselves we program our bodies and minds to only find pleasure through our own touch and actions rather than those of the one God intended for us. I am not saying it is sinful to please yourself, these are just things I feel apply to me, and perhaps other spouses out there.

    I am still learning about many things, sexually, since I am newly married, thus newly introduced to this world. It is a scary, fun and facinating journey to take with my husband and I don’t want to place stumbling blocks in the path when they aren’t needed.

  33. I’m with you, Learning, I feel the same way. I feel like it’s an ok thing to do as long as there is no lusting invloved, but I just don’t like it for myself anymore. In the past when I have done it (when alone), I’ve felt guilty and sad. I want HIM to be the one who pleases me. I like feeling like he’s the only one who can do it, and it makes me feel secure and extra sexy, knowing that his pleasure is all up to me. πŸ˜‰ Congratulations on your new marriage!

  34. I finally told my DH about me masturbating, fearing the worse–even though in my heart I knew he wouldn’t be angry or think I’m a freak–and it actually was qute freeing. I told him that it was something I felt ashamed of because no one ever told me about it or whether it was acceptable or not, and therefore I was scared he’d think I was a freak and he told me that it was normal. Just being able to talk openly about it and to share that he was who I thought about while doing so was so cool because it made me feel closer to him. It was very freeing feeling, like I don’t have to be ashamed should I get the urge while he’s at work–not that I still find it completely satisfactory with out him. He also shared that he’s done it thinking about me, which was kind of touching. So I still feel that I’d rather get my satisfaction from him, but knowing he’s not freaked out about me doing it is such a relief.

    And I am determined to talk to my kids–whenever it’s time–about things like this. It is so much harder to learn and deal with certain aspects of this part of marriage when most of your life anything sex-related was taboo to talk about.

  35. This subject really struck me. I believe that we are not to do these things to ourselves without our spouses with us. It’s robbing the sacredness of a husband and wife serving one another in intimacy.
    If your away from your spouse wait until you return home. It will increase the expectancy and the sweet arrival of your coming home.
    I have a strong conviction in my heart that this absolutely is no pleasing to the Lord if your doing this and your single. These feelings of pleasure were given to the marriage bed only.
    I want to see better Biblical back up on this besides Leviticus. Leviticus is the old covenant priesthood and since we don’t kill animals for our sins anymore I’m not convinced that it’s ok to do this away from your spouse or if your single.

  36. HisDelight, do you really believe that killing animals for our sins would make something “okay”, while the blood of Jesus would not? ” It is not possible that the blood of buills and goats should take away sins.” And as Ms Cinnamon Sticks said very well, the bible simply does not say that masturbation is a sin such as would need atonement anyway. Flavius pointed out that Leviticus tacitly but clearly approves it. Why add an extra sin to the word of God? Why? Does that make us feel safe? Safer than grace?

    I’ll tell this story not to be combative, but because I think it is helpful. Sorry if I am not tactful, but when you are my age nobody listens, so you have to be blunt.

    When I was a little girl, I had a strong conviction in my heart that picking my nose was a sin. I took the greatest pleasure in it, and it cost my poor little mom untold embarassment and occasional anger. But it was my guiilty pleasure, and I remember sitting in church with the big crucifix looking down on me…wiping boogers on the kneeling bench whil wondering what hell feels like. (Of course, you will never find in the bible where it says it’s okay for me to pick my nose.) Well, I’m a great grandmother now. At thanksgiving dinner my great granddaughter of just 3 yrs was playing among us in the parlor, and straddled the padded corner of the footstool. Well apparently it felt very, very good, and I’ll leave it at that. But the adults in the room got extreeeemely uncomfortable, and her poor mommy about died. Get the picture? Nose-picking, masturbating…pleasure, shame…shock , horror, arousal…srong convictions?

    As bond slaves to Christ we are free from the law that bings death. We are also free from petty jealousy, and free from the irrational fear that God has made our bodies as booby traps to trick us into hell. I’m not saying you need to masturbate, I really don’t care. But above all, we must not add to the Word of God just to explain why we feel guilt. Know the Lord. Trust the Lord. He is not crazy, he is kind.

    “This then is how we know that we belong to the truth, and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence whenever our hearts condemn us. For God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.” [1 Jn 3:19-20]

  37. Mrs. Flavius hmmmm I think you misunderstood my point about Leviticus, however lets talk about that verse. Leviticus 15:16-
    16β€³ When a man has an emission of semen, he must bathe his whole body with water, and he will be unclean till evening. 17 Any clothing or leather that has semen on it must be washed with water, and it will be unclean till evening. 18 When a man lies with a woman and there is an emission of semen, both must bathe with water, and they will be unclean till evening.”
    Verse 16 is referencing to a natural way that a man’s body releases semen. Unlike women, men store up semen. So the Lord created this amazing natural way for man’s bodies (and even woman’s too) to release this sexual tension. It’s called nocturnal emissions. Your body will release naturally. This is meant for those who aren’t
    married yet.
    “Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body.” – 1 Corinthians 6:18 (NIV
    When you pick your nose I don’t believe it brings the same feeling of pleasure as if your having an orgasm. Those feeling were designed by God to be shared in the marriage bed and no where else.
    Masturbation, when single or apart from the spouse, absolutely falls under the category of sexually immoral sin.

  38. It absolutely falls into the category of sexually immoral sin FOR YOU. God has lead you through scripture to abstain from masturbation. He knows you and your heart issues, but the fact remains that no matter how you look as scripture no where does it say that masturbation is sin. The Bible is VERY clear about it when it declares a certain act as sinful. The fact that God is unclear about this one thing requires us to seek Him in how we each need to respond respond to it. There are grey areas in life and this is one of them. There are many reasons why the Lord would free a person to masturbate and there are many reasons why He would lead a person not to. It would depend on whether or not it became something that controlled them, on whether or not they are able to do it without lusting, about whether or not (in marriage) the couple agrees on the topic.
    I think that a lot of Christians don’t like grey areas. They offend us. It’s easier to set up rules than to live in the freedom of our relationship to our creator. Because with freedom, comes greater responsibility. Greater responsibility to stay connected to the voice of God.

  39. Nocturnal emission for WOMEN? Huh? I have NEVER seen anything about this in any medical literature. Nor in personal experience. I do not/did not masturbate. I never had any “nocturnal emissions” all of those years that I was single. Yes, women have vaginal secretions related to their cycles, both blood and mucus, but I would be very careful to not confuse this with some way of “releasing sexual tension”.

  40. So if the bible doesn’t use the word abortion that means it may be right for some but wrong for others? I don’t think so. The act of something is a sin just as much as what’s in the heart. What else are you going to think about when you’re masturbating? Puppies? No, you’re going to put a face to the feelings. Why? Because you were made to have those feelings inside of a covenant marriage. When I was single I used to struggle with masturbation, and I’ll tell you the Holy Spirit convicted me and spoke to my heart, “this is meant for a man and woman to do in their marriage.” I confessed my sin to my mom and she prayed with me and I was set free.
    This isn’t something to just tell people it’s ok to do to without scripture.
    Since this is a Christian website I think what you talk about should have Biblical back up. I’d either delete the subject of masturbation on the site or remove the statement that this is a Christian website.
    Why would He free someone to masturbation?

  41. Not everyone thinks about other people when the masturbate. Many people think about their own bodies and what is happening. Some people also pray. I know, it’s a surprise to you. Clearly this is something that the Lord has convicted you about and I bless that. It would not be edifying for you in anyway.

    If you can not support that women who are Christians are also supportive of each person praying about whether or not masturbation is permissible for them, then you do not need to read here, but this is the last comment we will approve from you that questions our intense passion for and devotion to our Lord because of our position on this topic.

  42. You said: “What else are you going to think about when you’re masturbating? Puppies? No, you’re going to put a face to the feelings.” That may be YOUR experience, but I’m here to tell you that it isn’t everyone’s experience. I started masturbating around the age of 6. I didn’t even know what sex was. I just knew that it felt good. Even up into my teenage years I masturbated, and never put a face in my mind. I just thought about how good it felt. I remained a virgin until I met my husband. The only sexual experience I had was by my own hand and I had no explicit fantasies by then either. You need to back up and take a good hard look at the way you are talking to people and transferring your own convictions onto others.

  43. I understand. And I probably won’t read here again nor will I recommend this site to anyone. My heart is really saddened by this. But I know the Lord is good. And in that I believe we both can agree. Blessings.

  44. All the best to you on your journey.

  45. I am reminded, by this string, that a strong brand will repel as many as it draws. Soldier on, Nymphos, soldier on. And always be true to your mission. I applaud you.

  46. I think I may follow HisDelight and give up this website as well, unfortunately. I think the most troubling thing for me in this exchange has been cinnamonstick’s comment, “It absolutely falls into the category of sexually immoral sin FOR YOU.” I’m curious what other issues are open for interpretation simply because they are not absolutely explicitly written in the Bible. Related to sexuality, we have eugenics, cloning, abortion, stem cell research, throwing away of frozen embryos, etc. You can infer from what we know about the character of God that these things are unacceptable to Him, but nowhere in the Bible does it explicitly say that. In the same way, you can infer from what God has said about the sanctity of sexual intimacy in the context of marriage that intercourse is a very, very special thing that is to be shared by a husband and a wife. My husband and I are both in the military; there are times when we are apart. During those times, we wait. Plain and simple. No shortcuts, no easy way out of it. We are not controlled by our sexual urges; we can still function in life without masturbating when we can’t have sex for a time. (Of course, once we are together again, we don’t waste a lot of time getting started.) The waiting makes the anticipation that much greater.

    I think another troubling attitude is “I’ve done it my whole life, and I feel close to God, therefore it’s not a sin and in fact is a wonderful thing.” That’s simply not a good argument for doing something. How you feel about doing something has more to do with the formation of your conscience and your own personality than it has to do with that action is actually right or wrong.

    Now that you got me started, I’d like to refer to another one of cinnamonstick’s comments farther up on this page regarding Catholicism. I know you are going to disregard what I say when I tell you I am a Catholic (although I grew up very strongly Protestant). You said that you do not think it is harmless when a church adds to what the Bible says. I do not think you have a very good understanding of Catholicism, and I think you should not speak about things you do not fully understand. For example, where does the Bible say (explicitly) that there is a Trinity in the sense we understand it to be? Quite simply, it does not come right out and say that. Believe it or not, the Christian understanding of that comes from the Catholic Church. Let’s go a little further … where does the Bible say which books are in the Bible? (i.e. The Gospel of Matthew and not the Gospel of Thomas?) Nowhere does it say that; but the bishops of the Catholic Church put together the Canon that has been accepted for centuries, based on information that was not anywhere to be found in the Bible.

    Anyway, I apologize for the ranting, I am just very frustrated that a very good website has been ruined for me not by the people contributing but by the people running it who, in the name of not excluding or condemning anyone have both excluded and condemned everyone who thinks differently from them. Once I saw the above comment regarding Catholicism, I knew I was no longer welcome here, and when I saw the conversation from yesterday, I knew I no longer wanted to come here anyway.

    Thank you for reading and God bless.

  47. It is not new that masturbation is a divisive issue. Your relationship to God has lead you to understand from Him that He condemns masturbation. My relationship to God has lead me to understand from Him that it can be a healthy way to control a sex drive while single or to learn how to orgasm in marriage.

    You’ve said: “in the name of not excluding or condemning anyone [you] have both excluded and condemned everyone who thinks differently.” Nowhere have I condemned those of you who think differently than myself. I have in fact, both publicly and privately, blessed you to find richness in your journey with God. And I have done so with all sincerity. The condemnation is not coming from me. I do not have any problem with people who think differently from me. None at all. If any of you have felt condemned because you think differently than me, that is not truly coming from me. I have repeatedly said that I believe you are following what God has lead you to do.

    If anyone can not read our blog because of this issue, we truly bless you to not read here. It isn’t good for your hearts and it isn’t good for ours to have to repeatedly explain our understanding. We do not condemn you. We do not think you are following some random rule that someone else gave you. We really understand that God has given you scriptures to lead you in a different direction than He has lead us. His Word is living and active and will serve to instruct us in the way we should go and, as I have said, the grey areas are what requires us to have a connection to His voice so that we can manage our lives in a way that honors him. In the same way that I can bless a believer that lives out their Christian life in a different way than I do (gifts of the spirit, how/when to baptize, what is actually happening during communion, etc), I can bless people who have been lead differently than I on sexual issues (masturbation, whether or not to use contraception, whether or not to have oral sex…).

    To me, that is grace. I don’t want to control someone else to see God as I do. So we really do bless you. Please know that.

  48. It’s a sad day in which we live. Christians need to be discerning for themselves, not always looking for a black and white answer. I believe these gray areas are where God gives us grace. We are allowed to make some decisions on our own! We should read the bible and pray for the holy spirit to guide us. He will, but make sure your relationship with Christ is close enough so we know his voice when he does answer us.
    Spice girls, keep doing what your doing, and don’t be discouraged by those who stand against you. There are plenty of us who do respect your views! Thanks!

  49. Katie, I didn’t want to get involved in this conversation, but something you said really turned my stomach. I want to point out that to compare masturbation with ABORTION is ridiculous and very sad. I personally have spent much time investigating and researching abortion and all that is associated with it, and yes the Bible certainly DOES speak very specifically about it. Jerimiah 1:5 “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you…” -We were human beings before we were born. And I believe we all know very well what the Lord says about murder!
    and Exodus 23:7 “…Do not kill the innocent and righteous.”
    I believe that He is quite clear on the issue of abortion. It saddens me that you would put it in a group with “things that God isn’t specific about,” and compare it with self-pleasuring.
    On a lighter note, thank you spice girls for your wonderful web site. It has been such a blessing to my marriage already! Please keep up the awesome work!

  50. I agree that to compare masturbation with abortion is ridiculous. However, it could be compared to some truly gray area, perhaps alcohol consumption. It’s somewhat more comparable, anyway. And BTW, this is coming from someone that’s fine with both (in moderation and without allowing the activity to consume you or become an idol).

  51. OK,
    Spice girls, you probably know this already but – in this life, everyone can’t love you. You know what God called you to do, so KEEP DOING IT. Just want to say (as another year draws to a close) – thank you for taking on this often thankless job that comes without earthly pay. God bless you for the tireless efforts. Keep up the wonderful work and DON’T YOU DARE LET ANYBODY DISCOURAGE YOU. Hugs – me.

    One more thing – I love the way you remain polite and gracious even in the face of deliberate provocation. That, more than anything you may claim, tells me that you really are Christians. Keep letting God’s love shine through OK?

  52. WOW! I was away for a few days, and totally missed a very heated discussion! I agree with browneyedgirl, Cinnamonsticks, that was such a gracious, loving response (all of them, but especially the last one) that you gave. I just want to say again how MUCH I appreciate this site. I love, love, LOVE that anyone is welcome here, and that we are free to talk about all these issues and “grey areas” and ask questions, share opinions, talk about God’s goodness, pray for eachother, learn some stuff, and be free from judgement or condemnation. I am truly so thankful that you ladies felt called to do this and that you take time away from plenty of other important things in order to keep up this ministry!!

  53. Now that’s a fair comparison. πŸ™‚

  54. 1 Cor 7:24 Brethren, let every man, wherein he is called therein abide with God.;
    Rom 14:1-3 & 23 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations. 2 For one believes that he may eat all things (masturbate): another, who is weak, eats herbs (does not masturbate). 3 Let not him that eats (masturbates) despise him that eats not (masturbates not); and let not him which eats not (masturbates not) judge him that eats (masturbates): for God has received him. 23 And he that doubts is damned if he eats (masturbates), because he eats (masturbates) not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin. Gal 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherein Christ has made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

  55. Hyde & Seek, well said. You too, St. Paul! Thanks be to God for his unspeakable gift.

  56. It is definitely possible for women to have orgasms during sleep. It doesn’t happen as easily as it does for men for the same reasons waking orgasms don’t happen as easily for women as for men. But I can say both through medical training (BTW, women’s sexuality is not well studied) and through personal experience that it happens. For me it has been when sex with my husband hasn’t been possible for one reason or another and the physical need is building up.

  57. In the midst of silently agreeing with the Spice Girls’ point of view on this topic and being so thankful for this site’s existence (I believe God led me here, truly), I skimmed over the concept of nocturnal emissions for women. Verena’s post reminded me that I’ve had dreams about sex over the years, some which have brought me to orgasm.

    They started when I was in high school, around age 17. I didn’t really associate the release at the end with orgasm since they were different from the O’s I experienced from masturbation. I’d describe them as a slow build up to clitoral engorgement. Release wasn’t body-all-over but I would definitely extend my legs and point my toes. Even though I was a virgin, the dreams were sexual. If I woke too soon, I would try to will myself back to sleep for that release but that never worked. Looking back, I sure hope I didn’t talk in my sleep during these dreams! :-S

    In my 9 years of marriage, I’ve had some here and there. I realize now they mostly happened during times of sexual frustration and were a form of release. Embarrassingly enough, they didn’t always involve my hubby – which is the weird thing about dreams. You can’t really control what you dream about. I also realize now that I haven’t had any in about a year – since my sexual awakening, when our frequency changed from 2-3 times a month to about every other day.

    Maybe the topic is worth exploring in a future poll or post. Thanks again for all that you do, Spice Girls.

  58. Merry Christmas to all you Spicey Females ;-),

    These posts have been so interesting to read and catch up on….the ‘to’ or ‘not to’ regarding the ‘M’ word.

    There is something highly spiritually charged about this subject no matter what persuasion one comes from. I have been through the ringer regarding my private sexuality and equally ; sensuality.
    After literally living for 45 years before having the courage to simply look at my magnificent female anatomy and then discovering for the first time how amazingly blown away I could become through multiple orgasms….I am through with all the religious mind bending on this subject.
    Am I healed yet? No. I have a long way to go before I am whole. By my Lord Jesus Christ’s grace and mercy AND incredible love, I will strive to become all that He has created me to be and that includes developing my sexuality and sensuality.

    Thank you Spicegirls for providing me with so much information and for being chief enablers in my healing from a terribly twisted and warped sense of my sexual nature. I am in debt to all of you. You have ministered to my sad soul and in effect been a huge instrument in the Lord’s hands to bring about the most important healing in my Christian walk of over 25 years. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

    Who cares about the naysayers! Us freer women know the scoop and for that I shout AMEN.

  59. HisDelight, you prove my point precisely by your reply. This pasage positively does not say the emission of semen happens during his sleep, any more than it says his emission WITH a woman happens in his sleep. One must add that into the text to prove a point that is neither found in, nor consistent with, the bible.

  60. But Katie dear, should stop reading the bible too? Because the scripture says quite the same thing that cinnamon sticks said: “Accept him whose faith is weak, without passing judgment on disputable matters. One man’s faith allows him to eat everything, but another man, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. The man who eats everything must not look down on him who does not, and the man who does not eat everything must not condemn the man who does, for God has accepted him.” [Ro 14:1-2] The pasage concludes: “Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in your brother’s way. As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for him it is unclean. [Rom 14:13-14]

    If one’s faith is weak, and he thinks it’s a no-no to eat meat (or to touch the happy-spot), then fine. However, weakness of faith is not a virtue to be defended. One’s conscience must be freed with Truth, for “the Truth shall make you free”.

    “Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.” [Gal 5:1]

  61. Liberty is terrifying. Until you walk in it, and you discover the way of the spirit.

  62. I am totally unoffended by nudity (except my own, that is, I’m very squeamish about being sen undressed.) But I think as a tool to use against porn & lust addiction, it is not a tool at all. Lust addicts do not NEED porn, they just like it a whole, whole lot. And porn does not CAUSE evil desires, it just inflames them. (Likewise theft is not caused by money.)

    Trust me, every woman is naked under her clothes, and the clothes do not fool me one little bit. It is not the clothes that make a woman “my fellow-man”, nor is it the lack of them that make her my object of prey.

    This whole issue is about love in the heart, not lust in the eye. Which also happens to be the ironical meaning of Jesus words in Matthew 5: “If thine eye makes you stumble, pluck it out; if thy hand ofend thee, cut it off.” Obviously, it is NOT your eye that makes you stumble, God gave you eyes to KEEP you from stumbling. And plucking it out will NOT purify your heart. Remember, this is Jesus we’re talking about, not Plato or Augustine! Do we really believe that plucked eyes and modest dresses are a cure for sin? Of course not. It is LOVE that cures all the ills of sin, not “harsh treatment of the body.” [Col 3-something]

    “Hope does not fail us, for Christ has distributed his love out into our hearts by the holy spirit whom he has given us.” [Romans 5-something]

  63. What nice, clear thoughts!

  64. Here is some “medical literature” Tiger Girl has not read yet.

    My husbnd has 10 times my sex drive while we are awake, but he has never once had a climax while asleep. On the other hand I have had at least a hundred dreams that ended in climax. Often vivid, explicit dreams even that involved all five senses.

    I have had absolutely NO sexual experience exept my husband, and other men have no place in my mind, but my beloved Flavius has rarely starred in these dreams. I’ve never even seen porno, but my brain and glands still produce porno movies sometimes while I’m asleep, even at my age. The nastiest things, complete with no-hands orgasms (which is impossible when I’m awake.)

    Does that sound like an “amazing God-given mechanism” to rid me of unneeded orgasms? No, I didn’t think it would!

    Well, I don’t think that’s what it is for the men, either. We are part of God’s natural creation, with glands and brains and all sorts of natural drives and urges. In our waking hours we do not let those things lead our steps, nor should we unless we are in our husbands bed.

    Do I feel guilty about my dreams? ALWAYS. But only until I wake up! It’s not as if I do it on purpose. By the way, Mr Flavius thinks it is hilarious and I always tell him every detail. He’s so envious, it’s like a free pass but he never gets one!

    I must run now. It’s naptime!

  65. just to add what i hope will be taken in the good faith in which it is meant, because it seems some people are upset.

    you should understand that the “requirements” you speak of are not requirements to be Christian. they are requirements to be Catholic.
    protestant churches have many requirements too, though you may not see them because you are in that particular church looking out, not on the outside looking in — but they are VERY obvious to others.

    i write this not to get into some lengthy debate on the pros and cons on Catholicism vs. Protestantism, …

    but to point out that the important thing is we are ALL sister Christians, and it surely does not please God that we are unhappy with one another.

    there is a famous Catholic joke that goes, “a dominican and a franciscan priest were arguing over which group of priests were best — suddenly in a flash of lightning a letter appeared on the church altar. it said,

    “i love all of my children equally, and it pains me when you bicker among yourselves,

    signed,

    God
    Society of Jesus”

    which is a hysterical joke if you are Catholic, because it is really funny if you know what Society of Jesus means …

    but it also has a very pointed message we would all do well to remember.

  66. I really respect your thoughtful and respectful position on this topic. Your site has given me much needed guidance. Keep up the great work!

  67. I need some advice….my husband is incarcerated and has been for a few years and i’m not sure when he gets to come home…As christians we have discussed this on many occasions. Our relationship and communication is at its best and only getting better. From what I read it seems its ok as long as we are thinking of each other because we are not able to be physical. As a christian wife I remain faithful to God and my husband. He has talked to me on the phone while I did what I had to do and it was great. Our sex life has always been great and we have managed a way to keep it going even thru all these limitations we have. I just wondered if masturbation (so to speak) opens the door for lust or being fleshy or if we both should just say no to the sexual desires that arise and wait for him to come home? Not sure the answer but we are both in agreement with each other and on the same page. I just use a bullet and it literally only takes a min or two but me and him both enjoy it. it’s all we have and the anticipation is out of this world.

    any advice or comment?

  68. I think you need no advice at all. Enjoy your long-distance sex together!

  69. Well thanks anyways…not really long distance just limited lol. We see each other every weekend and we get to email and talk on the phone. God is great!

    Thank you

  70. During the times of the Sermond on the Mount, the common practice in dealing with theives was to cut his hand off so he could steal no more.

  71. First i’d lilke to say i’m glad a friend told me about this site!! and i’m pleased to see your bold courage about this often “taboo” subject.

    Of late what i have experienced is that when i masterbate, on an ongoing basis, it diminishes my wetness and and desire for my husband. I love my husband very much and we have a very active and “rambunctious” sex life … however, i have started and stopped with masterbation, just to see if it was in my “imagination” … the pattern was the same every time; the more i masterbated the less i desired sexual relations with him.

  72. I know one of you said it is wrong to replace sexual union with masterbation, but what if the spouse desires union on a more regular basis then the other. Then is it sinful?

  73. If “one desires union more frequently than the other” then it seems to me that you are not replacing any sexual union anyway. Let’s all remember: the guiding principle on “what is sinful” is the principle of Love, the “greatest commandment”. That makes things easy to understand, even if obeying can be difficult sometimes.

  74. Thank you. It has been an area of guilt for me and I wondered if it’s better just to wait until the next time together. It is sometimes SEVERAL days apart and its sooooo hard to wait and contain. Any other ideas that might help?

  75. Yes, PJ: Enjoy it!

  76. For my Kids (boys) is that how I sould explain it to them. (Answer on what the bible says about mastebation) I don’t want it to become a vice carried through life that might hurt their future wives. When they are teens and masturbating they will likely be thinking(lusting) about the girl next door then when they are married are expected to stop those thougts. is that right? Is that their duty?

  77. It’s long distance since you don’t share a bed. It makes *any* distance LOOOOOOONG. I don’t think you’re opening up your mind/heart to lust if you are lusting after the one who you are maritally committed to. And it’s OK to use toys, or just your fingers. Either way it is OK! Have fun with each other on the phone, but it is OK to “take care” of things if you are not on the phone as well. As you may not have time to be on the phone daily or whatnot.

  78. For the past couple of months, I’ve been struggling with it personally. Even though the Bible is not specific about it. I would suggest to you to teach your children based on principle. The Bible says to “Flee youthful lusts” and for Timothy to “Be an example of the believers…in purity”. The Bible may not be specific on alot of things but there are principles that Biblically answer that question. It became a vice for me up until recently even AFTER I was married. If you can teach your children lovingly to be self-controlled in their passions and be careful what they watch and what they look at as well as memorize Scripture, they will be disciplined husbands. As for you mom, women that care about the purity of their sons are rare jewels. Im praising God for you…keep them in prayer. Prayer rescued me πŸ™‚ Hope that helps…

  79. Mrs. Flavius, thank you for being a help. But the last couple of weeks, God hasn’t really allowed my spirit to rest concerning masterbation. He spoke to my heart just to wait for my husband to come around and not to be the answer to my own prayer. “The fellowship of His sufferings” is what came to mind. Why is it that I can’t be like my Lord, in bearing the sufferings that others may have caused? This is a cross and prayerfully, with patience and God’s help, I’ll bear it gladly. My husband and I have talked and he understands and is making an effort. I just need to take each effort, capitalize on it with praise, and be patient.

  80. Umm, so far, I’ve really only liked what you’ve said :/ I am scared that by believing what all of these others are saying that I would begin to disobey the Lord. My Husband and I have been married almost a year now and He’s never masturbated since then; he use to but now he says, he’s got a Wife and that’s what I’m there for πŸ™‚ But me on the other hand, well, lets just say that his love language is Words of Affirmation and mine is Touch. I feel like just doing what feels good sometimes, not all the time, but afterwards I feel sad, lonely, guilty, and almost after every time, my Husband calls or just gets home 😦
    My Husband’s payed and prayed about this while we were dating and asked other godly men but no one seemed to have any answers. I’ve been praying about it for a long time because I too want to Only “use” my Husband πŸ™‚ but… maybe God’s Saying nothing means No. ???
    Ugh, I don’t know what to do.

  81. I respect your views and convictions. In no way by sharing this am I urging you to go back on what you believe, but for me and a few of my married friends as well as my sister, masturbation in and of itself is a form of release. I understand where you might be coming from in feeling that God frowns upon such an act. I myself grew up in a very Fundamental background and anything perceived as remotely sexual was pretty much shot down and never discussed, let alone viewed in the proper light.

    I’m sure you and a lot of us here, including myself, can learn to find a way to redeem aspects of sexuality and see them in a more objective light. What conclusions we draw will vary greatly, no doubt. Masturbation is just one of those gray areas. Will be praying :).

  82. Let me say that i have struggled in this area as well. interestingly, the first thing that comes to mind is the scripture about (and i’ll paraphrase) … if your concience is burdened than it is sin for you.

    I’ve gone through different seasons in life; one where i’m totally convicted and convinced that masturbation is completely wrong, and against my marriage bed; to the complete opposite of this, in that, it actually helps enhance my sexual drive for my husband.

    I’ve finally decided to settle in the middle, and try not to get too twisted up about it. i’ve accepted that as long as my hubby knows and its alright with him and it doesn’t deprive him (again paraphrasing) … what is due him; then i will find it perfectly acceptable.

    honestly, i think that, that is all any of us can do. and don’t think the devil doesn’t like to see us women all emotionally upset and weak about it … this is his ultimate aim though isn’t it? to get us in a tither about stuff; i think it better to humbly accept each other’s consience of what is “sin for them” and what is not; and if we feel compelled … to pray for enlightenment for us all!! … as His Holy Spirit leads.

  83. I really like this post. I agree that what my husband and I determine is not right for us, doesn’t mean that we think it isn’t right at all. He struggled with porn and masturbation. For him, it is extremely difficult to separate the two. I believe that someone can masturbate and not be in sin. However, for my husband, it is extremely hard for him to do. Therefore, for us, it isn’t right. I’m not sure what I will teach our children when they get older. They are very young now and we have several years to pray and decide on what we will teach them.

    Thanks for your input!

  84. Lionhearted, I definitely agree that it is really what the Holy Spirit says to you personally because the Bible is silent on it. But there are Bible principles of purity within marriage that God has for us to make decisions. Satan, EXACTLY like you said, would love to get us in a tizzy about gray areas, but if not settled properly that gray area can be one of those “weights that doth so easily beset us.” Very nicely put πŸ™‚

    Madelyn, seek God. He will give you wisdom. Talk to your husband and ask his advice and seek God together, but like Lionhearted said, Don’t get caught up in it. It may be wiser if, because of the doubt you have of God’s leading, refrain from it AND replace it with something else whether it be Scripture about strength or praying or calling up a friend. Remember that what we do to the glory of God, even when it is inconvenient or hurts, doesn’t leave us with guilt. I will be praying for you. Listen to God’s voice. Much love πŸ™‚

  85. to PJ:

    i’m not sure i understand your “But …”

    “But there are Bible principles of purity within marriage that God has for us to make decisions.”

    could you please elaborate … it seems that you are saying that, yes if you (lionhearted) think its ok than thats fine; “but” if you reallly seek God’s standards for marriage ….

    is this what you meant PJ?

    And its fine right? that we each allow the Holy Spirit to convict us; but i couldn’t help but feel a little …. “doubled talked” by your post.

  86. Of course it’s fine that we allow the Holy Spirit to convict us, because what’s right for me may be a vice for you. I added that “But” because when we’re in doubt we ought to go by what we know is true. Sorry about that

  87. I’m not picketing against it. For me it was a vice and I had to go to the Bible to figure out why it caused such spiritual turmoil in my heart. For others, it’s innocent release. The state of everyone’s heart is different…so the “but” is there. I’m sorry if I came across bashing people who do.

  88. np PJ, thanks for clearing it up!

  89. My husband is in the military at tech school right now. we get to be together MAYBE once a month this month probably not even that. before we got married I really struggled with masturbation. My husband knew this. anyway, after we got married I struggled with whether or not masturbation was alright. now let me interject here that I had no trouble being ready to have sex with him whenever he wanted it (when we are together we typically have sex about once a day if not more i think) but sometimes I would just feel the urge while he was at work. because I had trained myself to think of it as sin (btw i do believe that it is sin before marriage unless, maybe you can do it without lusting. but for me i couldn’t really so it was sin) i always felt so guilty after wards. however before my husband left for BMT he told me that he was okay with it and explained why he didn’t believe it was sin as long as i was thinking about him.
    well, after much thought, i did masturbate while he was gone. I knew he was okay with it. now that he’s in tech school i still masturbate. he doesn’t mind if i do it alone but i’ve found that without his involvement i really don’t enjoy it as much so normally i don’t do it alone but we have phone sex and web cam sex. he says he doesn’t masturbate, not because it is wrong but because he simply doesn’t enjoy it. but he loves to know that in some ways he is still able to meet my needs even from so far away.
    your comment caught my attention because you said “if your away from your spouse wait until you return home. it will increase the expectancy and the sweet arrival of your coming home.” but I’m thinking based on your comment you’ve never had to be away from your spouse for months and do with out any form of sex. why not enjoy each other even from a distance within the healthy bounds of marriage. God has blessed us greatly why do we act like because there are times we are wrong to masturbate, all masturbation is wrong, even after marriage?

  90. Thanks for the info on masturbation. I’ve always thought of it as being inappropriate in marriage – surely your hubby is the one who should be stimulating you. I also believe masturbation is wrong outside of marriage. So, guess what, I’m approaching 50 and never masturbated. But I think I am beginning to change my mind!
    My real issue at the moment is that I want my dh of more than 23 years more than I’ve ever done and I’d do almost anything if it pleased him but his sex drive has become non existent. He has diabetes related erectile dysfunction (which obviously doesn’t help) but doesn’t care about sex enough to get any help. He also has sleep apnoea so we don’t even share a bedroom any more.
    I am not coping with this situation at all. I am desperate for sex but he won’t come near me. He says he loves me but laughs with embarrasment when I get a new sexy nighty or send him slightly naughty texts.
    The only way I can think of to deal with my frustration is masturbation but he would think that was weird. I love him and I don’t want to hurt him, nor do I want to give in to the almost overwhelming temptation I have to go to porn sites.
    Do you think it’s legitimate to use masturbation on my own in these circumstances?

  91. May be, you should consider what is written here:
    http://site.themarriagebed.com/problems/desire/how-to-get-him-to-want-sex

  92. absolutely! Good luck with all of it!

  93. Thanks for this link. I suppose I gave up trying these things a while back because they got so little response but I’m inspired to try again.

  94. I would take the time to talk to your husband about the situation before doing anything. You need to let him know how you feel, and tell him what you are thinking of doing because you are not getting satisfied by him anymore. I am sure he is fully aware of the fact that he can’t satisfy you with intercourse, which he probably beats himself up about. This is probably why he laughs things off with embarrassment when the topic is even kind of brought up. He doesn’t know how to deal with it himself and is embarrassed, which might be why he does not go seeking help. If you take things into your own hands without him there/behind his back, he will probably fall even more into depression about this if it is found out. You need to address this to him and offer some solutions about how he can please you and look for answers to helping his as well. I think if you don’t, this will separate the two of you in some way, therefore leading to a bigger lack of intimacy. It is always best to be upfront and truthful with your feelings and concerns before making decisions of any kind.

  95. Hi, I’m not sure if this website is still up and running because this article was written such a long time ago. My wonderful hubby and I have been married for 3years this October. We love each other very much and feel we are getting closer each month.

    But, sex has always been an issue for us though. It’s as though I have a much sex drive than him and I often get turned away when I approach him for sex. I have tried all sorts to seduce him and nothing seems to do the trick. Because of this, I have often resulted to masturbation and at times pornography.

    I am a naturally very driven and feel I need a sexual release. My husband is aware about the masturbation and pornography. He has said that he doesn’t have a problem with masturbation and even suggested that I get some sex toys for times when he is unable to make love to me (for whatever reason). There are times when I am so horny but, so afraid to approach him because of the rejection.

    I have served in my church for 14years and have always been taught that masturbation is wrong. I used to masturbate regularly when I was a teenager but, that soon tapered off when I became a young adult.

    I find myself wanting to release and not sure how to, especially if my husband isn’t so keen. Like today, all I can think about is sex and I am getting so worried that there is something really wrong with me.

  96. Ruby, there is absolutely nothing wrong with you and you are not alone. There are many other women who have similar experiences and it is a myth that men always have a higher sex drive than their wives.
    There is a brilliant book on this subject called The Sex Starved Wife by Michele Weiner-Davis – you can easily find it on Amazon. After 20 years of living with the frustration of a husband who just doesn’t seem to be interested in sex and thinking there was something wrong with me every time he turned me down, I wept with relief when I read this book as I realised I wasn’t alone and there was hope for my marriage. Weiner-Davis addresses all the possible causes of the problem and offers strategies for improvement.
    Your needs are legitimate. You were made by God as a sexual being and designed to get pleasure from sex. I know exactly what you mean about feeling horny and not being able to think about anything else because I’ve experienced that too. When you’re hungry all you think about is satisfying that hunger. But I don’t think pornography is the answer. I always had a terrible sense of guilt after using pornography because I was lusting after someone other than my hubby and I felt I was being unfaithful.
    However, you can’t live a completely celibate life. If you were gifted for celibacy God wouldn’t have given you a husband. I have never been very successful at masturbation, I find it’s like tickling yourself – it just doesn’t work. However, if it works for you to release your pent up desire then do it. After many years of frustration I have recently bought myself a vibrator. The release it gives me has transformed my sense of well-being. The next stage is to introduce it to my husband and try to persuade him that we can use it together. He knows about it, but the aim is to have him involved in some way in satisfying my needs rather than me on my own.
    This is how I look at it – my needs are physically normal, my husband isn’t fulfilling my needs and the vibrator is acting almost as a medical device to manage the situation.
    Having said that, the ultimate goal is to get back to a satisfactory sexual relationship with my husband so I’m working through the material in The Sex Starved Wife as well.
    So get a vibrator (buy online so that you don’t have the embarassment of going into a shop) and get the book. There is hope. And above all remember that you are normal!!

  97. There are so many reasons as to why one would be living in a sexless marriage. A wife or a husband can’t help how they feel and you simply cannot force sexual desire and feelings on someone. But communication is one of the keys towards success. The Bible tells us that our body is not our own, but it belongs to God and when we are married and loving each other, our spouse has given the authority over our body (providing we want to share it with them). Several books on sexual issues and sex therapists can be a great help for such a distressed spouse.
    The scriptures tell us that part of the covenant of the law of chastity is:
    β€œFor this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife”; (Mark 10:7)
    Paul, in 1 Corinthians 7: 3-5 says:
    3Let the husband render unto the wife due benevolence: and likewise also the wife unto the husband.
    4 The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife.
    5 Defraud ye not one the other, except it be with consent for a time, that ye may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again, that Satan tempt you not for your incontinency.

    Here we see the importance of sexual intimacy within the marriage bed and not once or never in a lifetime…
    Regular sex with your spouse is an honor and a gift from God as He is the one who created it.

    If the couple really loves each other, each one will see fit to satisfy the other in this regard even though one does not feel like it. He can always please his wife (or she can always please her husband) by sincerely give of one’s self unconditionally for the well-being of the other. It is a matter of love and communication in this matter.
    If a man (or a woman) does not make an effort to have sexual intimacy and abstain the spouse from it for long period of time, they are not living up to the commandment and the promises they made to their spouse when they got married.
    The reasons that sexual relations are approved by God, are not only for the purpose of procreation, but also for communicating love and strengthening emotional and spiritual bonds between the couple.
    Lack of sexual intimacy creates a big turmoil within the soul of a loving spouse (loneliness, feelings of not being loved, sadness and even depression and eventually ending in a divorce).

  98. btw there are Christian websites for sex toys which don’t have nudity or pornography. In the States try The Pure Bed (link on this page) or in Europe try Wholly Love (just google it).

  99. There is nothing wrong with you. I am in the same situation. And the occasional times that we share our bodies I am usually disappointed.

  100. I dont see why pornography needs to be brought into the home. Instead I would recomend that you mastubate in front of or for your husband to enjoy. By doing this you can use his precence for your visual stimulation. There is nothing wrong with masturbation, enjoying it with your spouse will either make you feel much better about it or even better will get him excited. Give him a show, show him how much you need his touch by touching yourself in front of him. If he does not participate thats fine enjoy yourself in front of him and let him enjoy you either visually or physically. Mastubating without your husband might let him think that you have been satisfied and no longer need him. Ponography might make him feel inaduquate, both are looser for you and your husband. Read the post about “turning up the heat masterbating for you spouse”

  101. ravieolis, if only things were that simple. The situation can be complicated by health issues such as diabetes or low testosterone levels, psychological problems such as depression or poor self image, past history such as being sexually abused or having ungodly sexual relationships before marriage. It’s easy to quote the Scriptures, not so easy to live with the realities of erectile dysfunction or having been the victim of incest. Love and grace are needed, not criticism. That and plenty of prayer and belief in a God who heals past and present issues.

  102. I have masturbated since I was a young child and have always had a strong sense of guilt because of it. I was sexually abused as a child,. so I’m not sure if that correlates to the reasons why, or if it is just natural.
    As a teen and young adult, I was always trying to stop, but ended up worse, using porn.
    I have been married for 12 years now, and I do sometimes use masturbation as a release, but, now I see my husband in my ‘fantasies”. My husband doesn’t know that I do this, we have never discussed masturbation. Any advice???

  103. My advice would be to talk to him and stop masturbating. I really like this website, but do not agree at all with the opinions about masturbation expressed hear. God did not design us to have sex with ourselves. Man and woman, that is how we are made. I think there are a lot of sex addictions that are going untreated hear.

  104. Fairy Nuff, how right you are in your comments and that’s why I wrote in the beginning “There are so many reasons as to why one would be living in a sexless marriage. A wife or a husband can’t help how they feel and you simply cannot force sexual desire and feelings on someone.” Thanks for pointing out in detail some of the reasons for living in a sexless marriage.
    My DH is having erectile disfonction many times (he is 65 and has diabetes) but that does not prevent him from having sexual intimacy with me. We take things as they come and as they are.

    Generally speaking, we can always improve in that area by using other stratagems, regardless of our past. Granted, we must be willing to find ways to overcome our negative history and our flows having in mind that God is always here to help us.


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